Podcast Episode 80: PFLAG

Alison : Hello, Jean.

Jean : Hi, Alison.

Alison : Here we are.

Jean : We’re back in the saddle.

Alison : That’s right. We’re back in the closet.

Jean : We’re back in ,

Alison : Which is an interesting. Oh, our windscreen keeps falling. I don’t think we can even use it. We’ll just be. It’ll be a nude microphone.

Jean : Okay, I love that. Actually. It looks very nice.

Alison : It does, doesn’t it? Yeah. With a little blue light. Um, uh, today’s going to be fun because we’re talking to people from PFLAG.

Jean : Right. And this is an organization that you were introduced to by whom?

Alison : By myself. I had just always heard of them. And, um, I have a trans, non-binary child. And so I decided I want to just see what’s there, uh, to get involved in and to see for outreach for myself and other people because.

Jean : And to support.

Alison : Right.. It’s quite a transition. Do you know quite a…. Something to take on as a parent. Do you know? And I want to support my child.

Jean : Yes. And so that is so you Alison. I know that, you know, that is how you move in the world. You are definitely someone that seeks to support those that you love. And and it didn’t surprise me at all when you shared with me that you were joining PFLAG, which is which stands for parents, family and Friends of Lesbians and Gays plus.

Alison : Right. And they they they are just an incredibly wonderful organization. The people are so kind. I’ve actually become friends with the people that were going to be talking to today. We’re going to be talking to Corey Berry. Right. And Farrah and I have to say, you’re going to you’re going to can absolutely love them. They they’re so kind and, um, funny and warm and are doing really good work, you know, really good work in the world, I think, right now. So.

Jean : Well, your mission. The mission of PFLAG is leading with love. So, uh.

Alison : That’s perfect.

Jean : That’s you.

Alison : That’s that’s you too.

Jean : So this is going to be great.

Alison : Yeah. Here we go.

Jean : Okay.

Alison : We’re so happy. So, Farrah and Corey, this is Jean.

Farrah: Hi, Jean. It’s so nice to meet you.

Jean : So great to meet you. So  i feel like I know both of you just what Allison has shared, but this is really lovely, so.

Farrah: Yay. Yes. Likewise. Yes.

Alison : You know, we’re we’re, um, we do a little introduction and we talked a little bit about PFLAG, but we would love to just get to know you guys a little bit better and sort of the mission of PFLAG because I think, um, people are always looking, especially nowadays, for support.  you know, so if you could just tell us a little bit like, um, maybe Corey, uh, you you’re both volunteers.

Corey: Yes that’s correct.

Alison : And, Corey, what what do you do for PFLAG? And then what do you do, like, in real life when you’re not, like a superhero?

Corey: Oh, yeah, well, for PFLAG, uh, so my, like you mentioned, I am a volunteer, and, um, my role there is the advocacy co-chair, and DEI officer. So I promote through advocacy. I, I work on different things to bring education to the PFLAG community. And, um, like I said, also the Dei officer. So, um, what I’ve been doing, I’ve been in this role for about a little about a year now, I think. So, uh, what I’ve been doing is promoting, you know, education, support, advocacy because that’s those are the three pillars of PFLAG. And so a lot of times it’s just sitting with someone. It could be a family, it could be a parent, it could be, um, a friend of someone that’s gay or, you know, like like a family member that is a friend of someone that’s either gay or non nonbinary questioning, etc.. So really it’s it’s a safe space for people to talk about their concerns or their fears. So that’s what I do through advocacy. But again, those are just titles really. Um, it’s just to identify who’s who within PFLAG. But it goes beyond that because our roles stretch. There’s really no limit to the co-chair of advocacy or the Dei officer. I’ve done so many things just by talking to others within PFLAG and within the community. So, um, that’s my role  within P-flag.

Alison : And in real life. What are you.

Alison : Yeah. Well, I’m Corey, uh, you know, and, um, I, I’m one of those people that, um, you know, we all, I think, um, this country, especially this country, and I think just based on how we were raised and what we’ve been taught, you know, you go to school, you go to college, you get a job, you get a title, you you make money and this and that. So yeah, I, I am working in education. I work in admissions at USC, University of Southern California. So that’s what I do for my job. Um, and in that job it goes beyond my title of assistant manager of admissions, I mentor, I coach, I support, I listen, I educate, so I don’t just lean on that title. Um, and and people know me for more than just that. So, um, as far as who I am, I like to just say, you know what? I’m Corey, but I do a lot more, you know, um, than just work. It’s it’s, you know, showing who I am, showing up every day for people, caring for people, being kind and supporting people in whatever way I can. So, you know, that’s the best way I can say who I am.

Alison : I love that.

Jean : Hi, I’m Corey and I’m an angel.  THANK YOU.

Farrah:  exactly. I’m Corey, and I’m directly from heaven. Yeah, exactly.

Alison : And tell us a little bit about you and your roles.

Farrah: Sure, so I’m Farrah. Uh, I’m the president of P-flag LA. Um, I’m going to share my pronouns..and I’m going to share my pronouns as well, they are  are she/ her as well. Um, and yes, I started a little later than Corey even… Our board is pretty new. Um, we had a big shift this last year. Um, but it’s been very exciting. We’ve been gaining all these great people and, uh, it’s been, uh, for me, it’s really been just like, we have people who are finding, you know, these, these great people for these specific positions. And it’s just been wonderful to, um, have all this new energy and people who really want to work for the cause of, you know, expanding spaces for the queer community and the people who love them, um, and really acting as a bridge to people who maybe, like, I don’t really know much about the LGBTQ plus community. Like, I have some questions and, you know, questions maybe people are afraid to ask. Like they’re just not sure. And to be able to have a group of people who’s like, hey, come on in. We’re here for it all. Like no questions off the table. Just ask, you know, um, has been, um, very inspiring. And it’s so and also all these people that were getting Corey, I mean, I, I think I can speak for us both that they’re just amazing humans.

Farrah: Um, just really want to, uh, contribute to the world, give back to the world. Um, and I just, I’m always, i feel so, like, tickled pink to be able to to, like, sort of lead this organization, help, you know, kind of shepherd and guide people. And really, uh, I was talking to someone earlier today where I was like, it’s not about leading people. It’s really about helping people do the best they can do, um, with their capabilities and skill set, like just really maximizing our people, but also paying attention to their capacity. Like, you don’t want to drain people either. You want to make sure that they have the tools they need to do the best work they can do for our shared mission. Um, and so that’s really. Yeah, that’s what I love doing right now. And I’m so thrilled to be able to be part of this, um, and just really uplift everyone who’s who’s doing the work and excited to do the work. Like, we’re all excited together. It’s like a really lovely little, you know, little organization right now.

Jean : I think that’s so important that the people involved have a passion and a and feel a sense of coherency within the organization.

Farrah: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, and so  we are all volunteers. Yes. So it’s really a roll up your sleeves. And, you know, it is like Corey was saying, we do so many, we wear so many different hats. We do so many different things. Um, but it is all in the service of like, hey, this is a program or event coming up. Like, you know who can help here? What can we do? Um, it it very much is like we do this together, you know? Yeah. And like, people contribute how they can write, like, um, and we appreciate whatever, you know, however they can contribute. Maybe they make the flyers, or maybe they’re like the people boots on the ground kind of thing or what have you, but it’s really making sure, um, everybody, you know, everybody’s pitching in when they can, how they can, and everybody’s acknowledged like, that’s that’s what I, um. Yeah, that’s that’s how we’re running.

Alison : And what do you have uh, because that’s a lot of work you guys are both putting in, and have like a job?

Farrah: So I do not have a job job. I’ve been a stay at home mom. Um, but prior to that,

Alison : That’s a Job!

Farrah:  It’s true. It’s a job.  Oh, my gosh, the unpaid job.  Oh, my God, I know that’s a whole nother conversation, ladies. My goodness. Um, and they’re teenagers right now, so I’m in a whole realm of teenagerdom.  Prior to that, I was very much, uh, in the arts, i did, um, I was in fashion design for a long time, um, designed for, like, BZBG, Tommy Bahama, Forever 21, back in the day. Um, and then I also did website design, um, that, uh, for, for a while and then now…. Yeah, now I’m just I’m excited to be able to contribute. I have the time, you know, kind of. Yes, we all do. I make the time, I should say. Um, and I’m excited to be able to contribute to, um, this organization. That’s just a wonderful you know, I think it’s been around for like 50 years, p-flag itself. So it’s just it’s it’s it’s a stalwart stalwart in the, you know, realm of allyship. And I think it’s just such an important organization to to really be a part of in this time.

Alison : Why do you guys think this is important? Why is this work important? Like, why are you why are you putting your time and energy into PFLAG?

Farrah: Well, I think particularly in this moment in time, a lot of LGBTQ+ individuals are kind of under fire. You know, um, there’s, um. And I think that it still remains a lot of LGBTQ+ individuals remain, um, kind of mysteries to, I think, general public. And I think, unfortunately, when something is a mystery, it can be thought of as negative. And so I think right now especially, it’s important to, you know, as one of our pillars is education. It’s important to educate people, um, about, um, these LGBTQ+ experiences that may not be, you know, the the general, in the general, you know, mindset or ether or culture. Um, and, and really show that it’s, it’s a part of the human experience. It may not be your personal lived experience, but it is a human experience, um, and deserves the same level of dignity and, um, attention and acknowledgement, uh, as any any other human, basically.

Alison : How did you get involved? Uh, I know Farrah. You have a child like I do. And, Corey, how did you get involved in PFLAG? Like, what was your impetus?

Corey: Well, you know, it was, uh, there was a time, you know, at my job that I work that I talked about at USC, where I was trying to find some new programming for our orientations, for our new incoming students. I work at a dental school, so I help dental school students once they get into the program, transition and all that. And so we acclimate them to the school, introduce them to things that they need to know as far as working with patients. So in that regard, I wanted to find something to educate them on with regard to, you know, maybe if you have never treated a patient or been around a patient that was transgender, for example, I wanted to find an organization that taught that to our students. So I googled and found PFLAG. So that’s how I initially became involved with PFLAG, inviting them to our orientations to talk to our new students, to orient them. You know, about patient care. That’s initially what it was about. Then I got to know them. They got to know me, and then the rest is history. I’m here, you know, they had this board position open and I decided to apply. And, um, you know, because I part of your question was, what got me here also is just, I go where I’m led. You know, if if I don’t question it anymore like I used to, because I just trust that I’m where I’m supposed to be and when I’m supposed to be there. And that Google search that day turned into friendships, um, mentorships, you know, um, you know, um, just just helping people, sharing, being generous to people, you know, in different ways outside of my job, because I don’t like to think of myself as a title. Like, like like I mentioned before, I like to think of myself as somebody who wants to just give as much as I can in different ways, you know? So that’s, that’s the that was how I began.

Alison : Yeah.

Jean : I thinks that’s so great. It’s like, don’t box me in. Right. We all – there’s, we’re so multi faceted and we all have, um, you know, our superpowers, you know, whatever. If it’s talking or organizing or whatever it is. Um, but, wow, you two are… So no wonder you both came from heaven. And two angels met each other and said, what do you feel that P-flag caters more to the individual… Like like, uh, the homosexual or the transgender? Or do you feel it caters more to the the family member?

Farrah: You know, I think it’s both like I think we try and do both. Um, I think it started as family member, like back in the 70s. It was supposed to be, you know, kind of family, friends, etc. but I think, you know, as it’s grown over the decades, I think it, you know, we realize that we need to support both. It’s a it’s a whole, you know, the family, the friends, your whole environment is kind of an organism.

Jean :  Exactly. And you can’t focus just one one…

Farrah:  Exactly. You need to kind of work with every, you know, work with everyone. And we’re we’re all on the journey. You know, I mean, the way I see it is, my child is on their own journey, and I’m on a journey that’s parallel to them. And I need support on my journey, too, right? Like, you can’t the whole, like, put your own face mask on before helping the other kind of thing. Like, I can’t just do it blindly and I’m so, you know, pleased to have a support, you know, system to help me along the way when I stumble or when I, you know, just there’s so many missteps. Of course, I know, um, one of our recent friends on, on our podcast that we just launched. Uh, but he was saying, you know, I’m an imperfect ally. And I think I think that perfectly describes it, frankly. We are allies, but we are imperfect. We are human. So we need our own support that we can provide. But but so that we can provide supports for our loved ones, for the people on their journey. Yeah.

Corey: Yeah. And it’s definitely community. I mean, yeah, the community is so far it’s it’s reaching and, um, it extends to whoever wants to, you know, whoever needs a hug, whoever needs a ear to listen to them, whoever needs that validation, um, whoever feels that they don’t belong, you know what I’m saying? So I think we can find that when we just walk outside our door. Yeah. Um, they might not know anything about PFLAG, but, um, they’ll be on, you know, they have those same concerns and those same wants. Everybody wants to be validated. Everybody wants to be seen, heard, you know, listen to and not just talk. Like not just saying, okay, you have to do this or you have to do that. It’s, it’s it’s about listening and really hearing, uh, who they are. Because we all have a story. And I think that’s what I learned over the past year, is that it’s not just gay men or or transgender woman or man or non-binary or questioning. It can be an ally like Farrah mentioned. Or it could be a dad. Um, it could be a mom. Um, just like, um, you know, um, Allison, when you were on the podcast, you talked about I’m not sorry, not the podcast, but the speaker’s bureau for my orientation. You talked about your experience. So it’s just bringing the experiences together and becoming a family in that way. So I think that’s what PFLAG is also about, community as a whole.

Alison : I think too, like we’re living in a time like, for me, we’re living in a time where you have to really be careful of your words and who you’re talking to. And when we hung out with with Nik Kasey, I want to give a shout out to Nick, who’s just this wonderful, wonderful person and go to the website. Go to his website…

Farrah:  nikkasey.Com.

Alison :  I love that person. I just love them. And when we were we, when we all went out to dinner, we were just talking so openly. And I realized, oh, that’s what safety feels like.

Farrah: Right.

Alison : Like that you guys weren’t going to get in the car and be like, what was Alison saying? God, she’s like a freak. I felt very loved.

Farrah: Right

Alison : how do you facilitate those conversations? How does PFLAG, like you were saying, Corey, that you’ve had conversations with people and you’ve had, uh, site visits with people. What happens at those? Like how do you how do people begin to open up to you guys? Because you’re really… It was such a great feeling.

Corey: Yeah. I think, you know you for me, I get and I can I for me, I think what I’ve learned probably over the past 10 or 15 years to trust myself. And then what that led to is understanding that people trust me a lot more than I thought they did.

Alison : Mhm.

Corey: I sometimes I’m on the metro. I could be um at a store, I could be at a restaurant and somebody will just start talking to me about their life and start opening up where I just, I’m just sitting there listening. But I don’t know if it’s my demeanor, if it’s my my smile. I don’t know what it is, but, um, people just.

Farrah: All of the above. Do you have a very open… You are.  you do have a very open demeanor.

Jean : I think it’s your energy.

Farrah: Yeah, exactly.

Corey: But yeah, people, I think. And that’s when I have conversations with people. Um, and then start to learn about them. And I it just becomes organic. It’s not forced. Um, it’s it’s natural. You know what I’m saying? And that’s what I think. Me and Farrah especially want to do. Because when we go out together to these events, um, we’ve been to a lot together. We’ve done tabling, we’ve done pride parades and everything like that. And, you know, it’s just looking at someone giving them that eye contact, saying hello is the start of that. I mean, and a lot of people can’t even do that these days. You walk past a neighbor that you’ve lived by for ten years and they never speak to you. So I think that’s how we connect and that’s how that conversation begins.

Farrah: Right. I think we do. We approach the world similarly where we’re just like, hello? Yeah. And then, you know, some people respond, some people don’t.

Corey: But that’s okay.

Farrah: We remain open. Exactly. We just remain open to if a person wants to respond, great. You know, and if not, fine, like you do you kind of thing. Um, and I do think actually, Corey, you just modeled what was great about like a PFLAG, say, meeting support group meeting where you said, like, just in my experience, you specifically said, like we do try and keep it and say, like, this is from our experience, so we can’t talk to everyone’s, but this is how we’ve experienced it. And it does in the group settings invite others to be like, well, I’ve experienced it this way. Um, and it can, you know, there are groups, you know, kind of sessions where people come from very disparate, you know, viewpoints, very disparate. Um, and but because it is, we set it up as a space to be like, we’re not judging people. We are taking everyone as they are. They are coming to, you know, we’re all coming to this place from a, from our own places of want. Being curious about others. Wanting to connect. Wanting to share and also be heard. So it’s like it’s very much, you know, as and it’s it’s usually about an hour, an hour and a half. But throughout that time, I feel like what happens is people sort of, they let their guards down and they start talking from their places of vulnerability.

Farrah: And, and everyone that’s there, you know, hears it and, and can respond and react, but not in, you know, it’s not about being hostile or being like the way I see it is right and you’re wrong. It’s like, oh, I see how you can see it that way. Um, and this is, this is how I’ve seen it. And, you know, it’s really just a sharing experience and really, really is more to be there to support one another for whatever experience we’re going through. Um, and I think it makes a big it ,yeah, I’ve seen it make a big impact on people where they’re like, oh, I didn’t realize that. I’m going to have to think about that or I feel more comfortable where I’m at, because we do get a lot of, say, parents and friends who are like, a friend came out to me and I don’t know what to do, you know, or my kid came out to me and I’m not sure, like, I love them. I want to support them, but I don’t know where to start. And so it’s very important for those groups, I think, excuse me, for all of us to just be like, okay, we’re here, we’re meeting each other where we’re at right now and and everything everything’s on the table and it’s all okay, you know, we can do this.

Jean : So do you, is PFLAG, would you say it’s like a counseling center?

Farrah: I wouldn’t say it’s a counseling center because we don’t offer that sort of, you know, level of service. I would say it’s like there’s part of us… It’s a support group. Yeah, it’s a support group. Right. Um, and and, our facilitators are trained in support, like just providing a space for people to come at whatever, wherever they’re at on their, you know, either their personal LGBTQ+ journey or their allyship journey, just to come and be like, hey, um, you know, even be like, this is what I’m dealing with today. Like, I just need to, you know, talk about it, talk about it, maybe get some insight. Yes. Get it off my chest. Yeah. Because I think. Yeah. Like, we we need those spaces, you know? Um, yeah. And just and just to be, like humans talking to humans, you know, we don’t we’re not. no one’s judging anyone from, you know, for anything. You’re everyone’s just coming as they are in that time, and we’re all just. We just want to connect, Basically um, and and say like, you know what, I see you, I see what you’re going through. Um, you know, that’s really hard. Just acknowledge that life is hard or but, you know, maybe you can learn some things. Maybe you can have some food for thought after this meeting kind of thing. Yeah.

Jean : And feel you’re not alone.

Farrah: Yes, yes. And do feel that sense of community of like, oh there are exactly. Because I think that is uh, especially with, you know, Covid and everything, just all our communities sort of shrinking, you know, to, to very small, you know. Yeah, just a few people, a handful of people almost. I think it’s amazing to be able to reach out to people that you just, you know, we’re strangers. Yeah, but we’re all we’re all, you know, going through life and and possibly having shared experiences that, you know, we can we can talk about and and share and commiserate like it’s really commiseration is is key. You know.

Alison : I think that, I think, uh, we’re living in a time where, um, so much is happening and, and I think for me, I feel like, is this…. I don’t know what I’m doing. I don’t know what I’m reading. I don’t know what I’m seeing. Like, we’re living in that kind of time. And so with with P-flag, I felt like, um, when I met you guys, I felt just like, oh, this is not unique.  I’m, I’m okay. I’m okay to be a little afraid. I’m okay to be, uh, jubilant. I’m okay to feel, um, um, like a great parent. And I’m okay to feel like, wow, I really did not do well in that situation.

Farrah: Right

Alison : what do you think the biggest challenges allies have in general that you’ve heard? Is there, is there some challenges? Or if someone how can how can we just give a little tidbit of someone knows someone that’s come out to them? What’s like a challenge that you think you could help or talk about?

Corey: Um.

Farrah: Do you want to take that, Corey? Yeah. You want to go first?

Corey: Well, you know, they they don’t necessarily, um, voice that. I think it’s a feeling of, um, fear and not knowing how to support them. They think that there has to be, you know, an answer or there has to be a specific way to be an ally. Um, we all have allies in our lives. So I always say, think about the allies you have in your life. You know what I’m saying? And, you know, whether it’s, you know, um, is someone discriminating against you for your race or your sex or is it your religion or something like that? Like, what type of allies do you have? Um, think about how they support you, how they show up, how they, um, listen. And a lot of times, that’s all that is needed as an ally. You don’t have to, you know, a lot of people think, oh, well, I have to go to a pride march, or I have to, um, you know, go to a meeting or to a you can you can do all those things, but it’s also just, you know, asking them, you know, what do you want to go out for coffee? Do you want to talk about anything? Um, you know, so I think it’s that fear. Um, they kind of put a wall up because they think they’re going to say the wrong thing or, um, not say the right pronouns, you know, because there’s so many new terms and there’s so many new ways of identifying.

Corey: I don’t even know. Half of them… I probably know a little bit of them, but it’s constantly changing. So I’m even afraid sometimes. And I grew up in an era where we didn’t… Me and my friend, my best friend in DC, we talk about this all the time. He’s like, do you use pronouns? And I said, no, but I use them, you know, according to what I’m doing or where I’m at. But in my everyday life, I don’t, I don’t personally use them because that’s not how I grew into this, who I am, but I support it. And, um, even though I’m in part of that community. So but people have to understand, look, you can be wrong and it’s okay. You know, people aren’t going to say, oh my gosh, I can’t believe you missed, uh, pronoun me or what have you. Um, they’re they’re going to forgive you. Um, and I still do that. So I always just say, you know what? Listen to your heart, um, have feeling behind what you’re saying. And make sure you have intention. And you, you’re you’re advocating for them. You’re listening to them. You’re supporting them. Um, you’re just being there. And that’s really all an ally is to any of us, you know? So I just say, think about it that way. But I think that’s the obstacle allies put in front of themselves unnecessarily.

Farrah: Yeah.

Alison : My ally is Jean.  Jean’s like the best ally. What you just said, I think, i never even thought of it that way. Just think of an ally you have. I can tell you anything.

Corey: Yes.

Alison : I never feel like, like…. And you’ll just listen. So that’s a great way of putting it, Corey.

Jean : And and I think for me, I don’t have a child that is homosexual or trans, but because my I have learned so much because of Allison’s child, who I love and, and it’s really helped me expand myself and, and see other people in a, you know, out of the box we were talking about. But I, I know that when I see Allison’s wonderful child, I, I don’t want to offend them and say the wrong pronoun, right…and  I know they would be so like they would laugh if I, you know… But I think that you don’t want to offend your friend or or misspeak in your. And we’re so in especially my generation, you know, we’re so conditioned. Yeah. Um, my daughter, who’s in her 30s, she can move and groove with, with pronouns, but I, it’s like I have to really be conscious.

Farrah: Right. I mean, I think it’s true. Like, at a certain point I still remember, like, grammar was huge. And so you had to be very correct, right?… About what you  said and like, “they”, you never used in third or, you know, it was like a rule, I feel like, so it was, it was very hard to, to re, you know, recreate those neural pathways are very trodden.

Jean : Wearing thin.

Farrah: Yes. Yes. Oh. It’s so. Yeah. So it’s it’s really difficult. I think, you know, a big thing for me is, um, is kind of being that bridge, I think, even generationally, because I do feel like, you know, kids maybe up through 20s, even into 30s, like, there are certain, um, there are certain things that are understood. And they, they, they are quick to judge. I think about maybe older generations having trouble, you know, with pronouns or with new terminology and etc. and like maybe writing off older generations. So I do feel like it’s important, as you know, uh, as the president of PFLAG, to be that bridge, to be like, hey, you know, we can’t just, like, cut off people because they accidentally made a mistake, like, and their intention is they’re like. And, you know, that mistake might happen a lot. I mean, it happened a lot for me, even with my own child. Um, and we have to be able to kind of, you know, forgive, accept that people are fallible, you know, and but still know that people are allies and they’re trying. And it may just be, it’s really tough. Like those those pathways are really set. Yeah. Are really set. Yeah.

Alison : or just say, I’m sorry.

Farrah: Right.

Alison : I’ve made the mistake. I immediately say I’m sorry.

Farrah: Right.

Alison : Let me just take that back. I was I was texting Nick. Uh, I miss pronouned, my child.

Farrah: Okay.

Alison : I immediately texted Nick, and… Yes, i don’t know where that came from. I’m so sorry. I thought it was disrespectful to my child and to even you. And I’m sorry. Right. And it felt like. Well, um. There it is. And then I called my kid and I said, this is what happened, and I’m sorry. Yeah. And I feel like coming clean in that way.

Farrah: Right.

Alison : Owning my mistakes has been a big learning lesson because, you know.

Farrah: Right.

Alison : I’m very stubborn. I’m from the Bronx, you know. I know it… And I don’t, I don’t.

Farrah: Right.

Alison : And I think you’re right. Forgiveness and taking responsibility. I’ve learned so much about on this journey.

Farrah: Right, right. and just being and just, and being kind to yourself. Right. Yeah. And being like, oh, I’m gonna I’m gonna make that mistake. It is a mistake that I make. And, um. Yeah. And just kind of being like, that’s okay. Yeah, it was a mistake. I didn’t mean, you know… I know myself, you know, like knowing in your heart that you mean the best, right? I think is something that, you know, allies, you know, we we are constantly working on.

Alison : And that’s what the world needs in general.

Corey: Yeah.

Farrah: Right. I mean, yes, one would hope. I mean, I really.

Jean : Think we need that.

Farrah: It’s just loving ourselves a little bit more loving.

Jean : it says right here…Leading with love.

Farrah: Leading with love. And, you know, one thing I did want to mention about, um, you know, kind of being an ally. I think an important part of of being that, you know, and this is probably more for allies who are a little, you know, more comfortable being the ally, have been out there a bit more, you know. So this is not for like I’m just starting out. But what I, I do feel strongly about is, sort of teaching the world, showing the world that, um, you know, if someone’s different, if some whatever the difference may be, whether it’s race, gender, LGBTQ plus, you know, um, sort of, uh, designation or what have you, it doesn’t detract and it doesn’t negate from, from you as a person… From like, because I feel like people, you know, all the fear mongering that happens about various LGBTQ+ issues is because people are like, oh, no, it’s going to take away from my own experience to acknowledge this or acknowledge or accept, um, I want and I think it’s a it might be a very American cultural kind of thing where it’s like, oh, no, you’re going to take away from me, but I want it to be I want us to be able to say, no, it’s not about taking away, it’s about being additive and adding to the experience of of being humans on this Earth. You know, like and just it’s it brings more it’s more joy, it’s more love. It’s more acceptance. It’s more celebration of just the beauty of, of of humanity, you know. Um, and so that, to me, is what we as allies, I think can do and can help express, um, as we are those bridges to various communities, etc. like just saying, hey, look, it’s it’s not about taking away from you. It’s about adding to the world of of beautiful experience. Right? Basically.

Alison : It’s adding to the colors of the world, right? The texture of the world.

Farrah: Exactly.

Alison : Yeah. Yeah.

Farrah: Yeah.

Jean : What are you guys working on now at PFLAG? Is there any.

Alison : Well, the Podcast is fantastic.

Farrah: It’s true.

Jean : Okay, well, that said enough that I know there’s a lot of podcasts out there. It is a lot of work. I mean, you know, you have a lot to….

Farrah: It really is. Yes. We’re going to need to talk to you guys offline about just tips and tricks and things.

Jean : Oh, we’ve got so many.

Jean : Oh, good.

Alison : We are. We’re the worst. We’re like the don’t do… Like the before picture.

Farrah: We can learn from that though. We’ll take whatever you’ve got.

Jean : that’s Right.

Farrah: Seriously, let’s. We can grab coffee and we’ll just sit and chat. Yeah. Just all whatever, whatever experience you can lend to us, we will take, frankly.

Alison : Can you tell us a little bit about your podcast? Because I’ve, I saw, I listened to the first one, which I thought was so fantastic. I have not listened to the second one yet. Could you talk a little bit like did you have fun doing it? Like, what do you think of it?

Corey: Yeah, it’s pretty eye opening. Um, you know, and it’s really just having conversations. Um, so we’re going to have a guest each time. And, um, some of the guests may be allies. Some of the guests may be someone in the LGBTQ community. Our first guest was an ally. Um, and I met him, of course, through Farrah at the, um… I think it was the LA pride, if I’m not mistaken. He is an ally because of his own child. And he brought some dads with him. And I noticed him. You know, I was never I never even…. We talked about doing a podcast back then, I think. But I didn’t see, you know, oh, is this going to be in five months, six months or whatever? So I wasn’t really in that mindset, but I was looking at him and I was just like, wow, he has a presence to him. So it’s Farrah’s friend and I, when we were discussing the first episode and who we’re going to have, I suggested him and, um, really just wanted to have a conversation with him because of who he presented himself to me and who he was at that pride was exactly who he showed up as, um, at the podcast.

Corey: So it was really great. It was a conversation. It was, um, organic, um, and it was healing. And I think the part of these, I think what I want to take from it and just like from everyday life, is to be healed in some way. And so I think, um, you get healing and just other people and sharing and being generous to them. And, um, just like I was to Orlando, he’s a coach as well. And um, I told him I, you know, I, I always validate people without, you know, specifically being the reason I’m talking to them. I, I told him on the podcast, I said, Orlando, you something about you stood out to me, even though we didn’t talk much. But I was kind of just watching you from a distance. And, um, I learned so much from him just in that moment. And then look at what happened. He ended up being an ally on our podcast. So that’s really what it is to me. Um, and I’m sure that’s what it is going to be to the viewers and to our co-hosts, um, and to the community. And that’s what it’s intended for.

Alison : I loved it because it is like, yeah, you just have a conversation.

Corey: Conversation. Yeah.

Alison : Do you know? And you just learn so much. And whenever we end these things, we always just are floating because there really is so much good in people…kindness, you know, in people, and I think that’s, you know, the whole the whole point of this is just to remind people that we, as you guys said, we’re all basically the same.

Corey: Right.

Alison : You know, we all want to laugh and feel safe and go for coffee. And our kids are good. You know, that’s all what we want.

Corey: Right yeah.

Farrah: Right.

Alison : It’s beautiful. You guys are so wonderful. Can you just tell us the name of the podcast so our listeners can listen to it?

Farrah: Oh, right.  It’s the PFLAG Los Angeles podcast.

Alison : Oh, great.

Jean : very original

Alison : A lot of info.

Farrah: Exactly. Trying to think of some sort of, like, cute name and whatever. And we’re like, you know, it’s just….yea…let’s let’s just throw it out. This is exactly what it is.

Alison : Same thing with inside wink, as you know. Yeah.

Farrah: Oh, yes. I love inside wink though.

Alison : It’s the Complete opposite. You know.

Farrah: It’s true. It’s true.

Alison : So I guess I’m going to ask you. What do you think inside wink means?

Farrah: Oh. That’s true. I had I thought, okay….

Alison : That was your homework…

Farrah: I know that was my homework, and I failed.

Farrah: Uh. Well, I find I finally came up with…. It’s not going to come out clearly, I apologize.  I feel like an inside wink feels very internal to me, and it feels like something in my heart where it’s like, you know that Farrah, you know, like…. Or you know what? I’ll give an A description. When I first met Corey and we first were tabling together at a WeHo pride event and we just started chatting inside myself, I kind of gave myself a wink like, you guys are going to be friends, you know that?

Alison : Yes.

Farrah: And so that’s what an inside wink is to me. Just that little like, hey there, you know.

Alison : I love that.

Farrah: Yeah.

Alison : I really do love that. Corey, what do you think?

Corey: You know, it’s it’s it’s really, um, to me, what it means is that, um, and this is how I talk with my friends, you know, is that if if someone needs you… You’re there for them. It’s like that I got you. Um. And I say it all the time to, um, people who are close to me who are sometimes doubting themselves or, you know, so it’s just that common that, that thing that doesn’t even have to be spoken. It’s just known just by a look. It could be just a feeling. It could be a hug. It’s that. It’s just that giving of each other, you know, because we can’t just take, take, take, take, we have to give, give, give too. So I think it’s just being generous with our hearts, you know, and um, sharing whatever we have to share, you know, because like you said, we’re all the same. And, um, it’s just giving us giving that nod of approval. And, um, I see you and I got you. That’s what it means to me.

Jean : They’re beautiful answers, both of you. Those are great…Beautiful.

Alison : Pie, Cake or ice cream.

Jean : Okay, so Allison and I love to get a good night’s sleep. So we’re going to really need to know what do you prefer, cake, pie or ice cream?

Farrah: Corey, you go first this time.

Corey: That’s a hard one. I wish I could say, I wish I could say all of them, but, um…. Ido have said that.

Jean : You can, People have said that.

Corey: Oh, really? Okay. Well.

Farrah: But if you had to choose.

Corey: Yeah, if I had to choose – cake. And carrot cake is my ultimate. I can eat carrot cake every day. I love if if it were healthy for me. Um, so. But it’s not so… I don’t eat every day.

Jean : It’s not?

Farrah: I know. Wait, what? Carrots are a vegetable. It could be, you know.

Alison : Exactly.

Corey: Yes.

Farrah: Oh. So my mine is similar. I also like cake. Uh, but it was… I would have liked to. There’s certain things that I like about all of them. I know, but in terms of my, I think I still remember this when I was little and the first time I had angel food cake. Oh, and it wasn’t even like fancy. I think it was literally like store bought angel food cake with like, whipped cream and strawberries on top. And I was just like, I am sold. This is the best thing. So I still just love it. I think from, you know, all those years ago when I was like a little girl.

Alison : I love that.

Corey: Yeah. That’s nice.

Alison : Do you know what cracks me up? We have these guests like you guys. So you guys are talking about challenging topics, healing, uh, community, uh, LGBTQ. And then we say pie, cake or ice cream, and you’re like, well, that’s a tough one. That’s hard.

Corey: It is.

Alison : And, you know, we talked to like, philosophers and scientists. We get to this last question and they’re like, that really gave me pause.

Corey: Yeah. It does.

Farrah: That’s true. You guys should really do like a psychological study on that and be like, why is this so tough? Why is this?

Alison : It’s so vulnerable.

Farrah: This is the thing that gets us.

Jean : Now You’re really getting down to some very deep intimate.

Farrah: Exactly. I mean, I think I think that you’ve hit the nail on the head. You really… You drilled down with those questions, I think.

Alison : And yet another example why you don’t want to follow us and tours for a podcast.

Farrah: Oh my God, I love it though it was…. I loved that those were the questions. You were like, you must answer these. I’m like, okay, this is good…it makes you think.

Alison : You get to know people in a different way.

Corey: You really do.

Farrah: It’s true. It’s very true.

Alison : You guys have meant so much to me and really … Jean knows I’ll start crying. You guys really meant so much to me. And, um, you’ve really just boosted me up. And just knowing that you’re in the world has helped me. So if you need anything or you want me to participate in more ways. Yeah, I’m your person.

Farrah: Oh my gosh.

Alison : I just think the work you guys are doing and how you’re doing it with your kindness and openness, you know, just be kind and you are walking example. So thank you. So.

Corey: Thank you.

Farrah: Yeah I hope you know the feeling is absolutely mutual Alison. So just know that I know now I’m tearing up too.

Jean : Because I’m Alison’s ally..

Farrah:  Oh my gosh.

Jean : That goes Double for me.

Corey: So we’re so happy to finally meet you and hear more about you , Jean and, um. Yeah, I, I feel that from you just on this one, what, 45 minutes that we’ve been on? Um, the warmth comes through just as much, so…. Thank you.

Jean : Thank you.

Alison : Yeah, well, have a great day. And thank you so much for taking this time to talk.

Farrah: Oh, my gosh. Thank you for having us. Yes. Well. Coffee soon? We definitely soon. Okay, bye.

Alison : Bye bye.

Jean : They were so lovely,

Alison : Aren’t they? And they’re smart and they’re passionate. And the thing that kills me is she has such an easy laugh. Like. Like she’s just bubbling over. And Corey, every word he used, like it’s healing, it’s there. And you go, God, Corey you’re so he’s so present. Like, they’re just a perfect team. Yeah. You know, I just I really meant what I said.

Alison : I know you did. I mean, they were both so benevolent and so pure of heart. You know, you could feel that purity in them. And and I think when they are in the perfect place. I mean, I loved when Corey said he he he’s just like was he doesn’t overthink. He just whatever comes to him, he just goes with it, right? Yeah. And and I love that. It’s like really trusting the universe that this is where you’re meant to be. And he just shows up with and and so does Farrah with just show up with love. Yeah. Wherever you are, show up kind, non-judgmental, with a helping mind and heart.

Alison : I think, you know, I’m oddly like I went into this thing not knowing anyone, and my first meeting was with those two in this room, and then we had to speak together, and, um, I, I was so nervous, like.

Jean : I remember.

Alison : You know, I was so, so nervous. And then, um, I just realized, oh, they were just curious about me. And they were like. Like like you. Like, I don’t know, it was just so easy, right? And I thought, wow, I hope I’m like that.

Jean : You are so like that.

Alison : Like to new People you thank?.

Jean : 100%. And I think what Farah said about, you know, when we don’t know something, we we can get a little bit standoffish or whatever. But you know, just to be curious.

Alison : Yeah.

Jean : She said something to that fact.

Alison : Yep, yep. Exactly.

Jean : Because we don’t understand or we don’t get it. And what does transgender mean? And and you know, it’s like we’re all just being curious to know more about each other.

Alison : And we just want to love who we want to love and live in a way that is open and respected. Do you know? And so if, if you or anyone you know is going through, um, anything like, uh, people, someone came out to you, or you’re thinking about coming out or transitioning or anything…. Pflag is an excellent support base for you, I think.

Jean : And I think they they have about 360 offices around the United States.

Alison : And so really they’re it’s just a wonderful – the people are wonderful and— love each other, you know, love each other. Love who you want to love. Love each other. Be kind, be respectful. That’s my lesson from today. Do you agree?

Jean : I, I think that is how you move in the world. Alison. So. So, um.

Alison : I love you, Jeannie. And where you’re where your allies.

Jean : We are.

Alison : We are. So have a great day. And thank you for listening.

Jean : Bye.